JACKBOOTED THUGS

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Mk3 » Tue Jul 12, 2016 7:07 am

Rench, that's not chivalrous, it's common fucking decency, and probably where we're headed. The only boon the civilian population has in my eyes is the lack of police conscription authority. In the infinite words of Ron White "sooner or later, you're gonna run outta jelly". As for what would happen to you in the current climate for stopping a crime with a gun: you'd go to jail, but it would be a hell of a spectacle. Firefighter charged with assault with a deadly weapon after stopping brutal police assault of soccer mom who failed to signal while turning left.

Pattio, I agree wholeheartedly with your input on Dallas cops using the tools they had, and (pulling in another thread) if we culturally put life ahead of the right to bear arms, perhaps the non lethal options would be developed. I haven't changed my stance on that, if anything it's redoubled, but I think yours should take primacy, and frankly was always supposed to Life, THEN Liberty, THEN Property (I prefer the first draft). You as a human (all men) have the indelible right to be alive, which cannot be impinged upon.
Further they absolutely blew-up an intelligence asset, and they assumed a suspect was guilty without the opportunity to be proven innocent (liberty).

I'd like to be happier that I called this in May, but it really just turns my stomach. The fact that there had been a whopping two hours of negotiation is supposed to somehow make this better, really emphasizes to me how extra fucked up it is. Now, if say the negotiations were failing and the only way to stop him from actively sniping people was to blow up the side of the building, I'd actually be better with that--in that scenario there actually isn't another option. But crap-sake send in robocop with a damn flash-bang.

In fact, who in Ootmicdom has some robotics background? I'd like to go into a venture with you on a new bot, we'll market it to the police, and make a non-killing. [not kidding]

The part of Serve and Protect that include protecting the rights of the accused has apparently completely goddamn disappeared. A big part of that is that cops when accused are not required to face repercussions in the same way as the general citizenry; back to rench's question. I don't go around beating the hell out of snarky douche bags because among other things I'll go to jail for it. Police seem to have culturally forgotten the part of their job where the enforce all the laws, and protect all the rights of all the people, especially the ones we don't like.

Thinking about this is giving me dick cancer, I need to get back to painting my house so I can sell the bastard and get out of the bible belt.
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Rench » Tue Jul 12, 2016 7:17 am

Bah. Cager should've signaled. I wouldn't interrupt that.

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Wed Jul 13, 2016 1:11 pm

This is also another interesting article: "The Near Certainty of Anti-Police Violence"

The Atlantic wrote:...What does it mean, for instance, that black children are ritually told that any stray movement in the face of the police might result in their own legal killing? When Eric Holder spoke about getting “The Talk” from his father, and then giving it to his own son, many of us nodded our heads. But many more of us were terrified. When the nation’s top cop must warn his children to be skeptical of his own troops, how legitimate can the police actually be?...


I'm generally not a huge fan of Coates, but I think he's spot-on on this one.

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby jae » Thu Jul 14, 2016 5:47 am

I give my own children the same advice.

I don't know how relevant this is, but stick with me a bit... My oldest (7) got stung by southern flannel moth caterpillar last night. If you're not familiar with these, they're also referred to as "asps" or "puss caterpillars"; whatever you want to call them, they have a nasty sting.

Image

My youngest (5) asked me why God would make a bug like that that's so bad. When asked why it's "bad", he replied "because it hurts us". I explained to him that the bug's defense mechanism allows him to stay alive, protecting it against predators. It doesn't maliciously attack. The same way a tiger, or even a dog isn't "bad"... just because it can hurt you doesn't mean that it is inherently "bad". Sometimes it's your responsibility to recognize certain dangers and do what you can to minimize them. Look at your chair before you sit down outside, and you won't find yourself setting your arm on top of something that's going to hurt you.

I guess my connection is that while yes, there are "bad" cops out there, and they should definitely be addressed, they are all asked to do a job that can get them killed on any given day. It seems there are hundreds of videos out there where they have a split-second at most to recognize that the driver they pulled over for speeding (or his passenger) has a gun pulled as they walk up to the window. This is a thing that does happen, and if they're not ready for it, it could mean their life. Yes, this also means that for the other 99.9% of the traffic stops (civilian interactions, etc) they make they have to be equally prepared. It is naivety to not teach your children that there is this side to the officer's job, and while it may not seem "fair", it is something to be accommodated. We ask them to do a job that daily gets them killed, and don't understand when there's a negative reaction to an action that appears legitimately life-threatening.

I don't mean to down-play the very real bias toward skin-tone, or to defend those who abuse their power out of spite, hatred, or whatever, but to make another analogy, we shouldn't ban fire just because people are too stupid or prideful to take precautions and occasionally get burned.

edit: sorry if this seems insensitive to the BLM ideals, but this is primarily in response to things like this:
phpBB [media]
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby guitargeek » Fri Jul 15, 2016 6:42 am

...because there is no God?
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Mk3 » Fri Jul 15, 2016 7:03 am

While there is certainly validity to look before you leap (or sit) that doesn't really change the dynamics of wanton assault on a group of Americans in America. The organizational culture has become flawed, things changed from "protect and serve" to "get home alive". While it absolutely sucks to go to work and fear for your own life, when you volunteer to do so that is the world you signed on to. Confronting hyperbole upfront, it is not the police (or service member, or firefighter)'s job to go to work and die, but it is your job to risk your life for the lives of others. That means reacting to situations of inherent threat with cool reserve, even if it is less-safe for you. Simple example, from yesterday, I saw this personally yesterday: a woman had her car to the side of the road in a benign suburban neighborhood, and there was a police vehicle with lights on behind her [I was driving the opposite direction]. I don't know if she was pulled over or stopped because of a vehicle malfuntion, but there did not appear to be an accident and no other vehicles were pulled over. The woman stepped out of her car and was walking calmly with empty hands toward the police officer (also female) who had also stepped out of her vehicle. The police woman's hand was on her pistol. There was no visible threat. In the military, in the warzone, in a comparable situation, this would be a violation.

When people see you as a lethal enforcer, as nothing but force, they react with self preservation in mind rather than community. If self preservation means killing you (the enforcer) they are very willing to do it, to abate this, you need to build a community. This was in my neighborhood. I am now less likely to call the police, especially if my child is nearby, because I no longer trust their training, and their defaults. Having held lethal authority has made me more wary of it than ever before (I mean, no one should trust me with lives, much less hundreds at a time). When in situations requiring the aforementioned split-second decision making muscle memory is irrefutably key. If the muscle memory (ie training) is to grab a lethal instrument, then use of the lethal instrument will be the default condition, and the killing continues. Now to the race piece.

We as humans have a natural disposition to dis-trust people that are different from us. Our culture defines how we establish those differences, but race is fairly typical, as it is visually obvious. THis has developed of millenia, and on the whole kept us well off as a species who identifies other groups and their territories as off limits. This matters when considering that most of the police force is white, and likely being raised in a community where non-white people are "them" a given individual policeman will organically default to mistrust and weariness of them. That much is natural, and to deny it is to instigate further problems because it allows ignorance to the necessity of rigorous training to react non-confrontationally.

The standard I've been taught is low ready; it projects confidence, and leave you able to react quickly, but the people around aren't instantly thinking about whether or not they are getting killed today. Barney is at (more or less) low ready. I perceive that while he has lethal means available, he is more interested in keeping everybody happy as a community. I do not perceive Barney or Andy as an immediate threat. Opie is a soulless ginger, and is therefore always a threat.

Image

Yes this imparts a delay of up to a few seconds before you can be lethally armed. Yes those seconds may mean your life. This is the hazard of volunteering to put other people's lives first, and while it sucks, you do so with noble intent.


This guy is ready to kill me. I perceive that his first action will be to shoulder his rifle. The most effective means I can see of staying alive with this guy is to shoot him in the damn head, for I too am a lethal instrument.

Image


I have taught my son to be respectful toward the police, and be compliant, but to do so in line with what he knows is right. That if he knows he's in the right, don't argue, follow directions, and we'll sort it out later. I had to have this conversation with him after we were on the playground and upon seeing a police car he said to me "dad cops, we need to go" this was two years ago, he was five, and I puked in my mouth. He learned in daycare from his very diverse friend group, all military kids, that it is safer to walk away when you see police then to continue what you are doing, even benign activities. My son taught me about what it means to be a non-white kid in the US, without ever meaning to. [since the dearth of humor in my post is bothering me, though my external reaction was to be calm, internally I was thing "I pay homeowners fees every year for this crap-asstic little park, let that motherfucker get out of his car, I'll ask for his mothrefuckin HOA tag" because after all I'm still a white suburban asshole]

The bottom line: If your training gears you to react with violent confrontation, even the really good guys are more likely to make really bad decisions. The tiger, the bear, the caterpillar, none of them default to attacking, they all need to be cornered to attack or in the case of the predators actively looking for something to kill. When it comes to survival, animals (including people) run first, defend second unless people teach them to do otherwise. Obviously we don't want police running away, but we don't want the first reaction to be shooting, really it shouldn't even be a reaction, it should always require deliberate thought and intent. That is the nature of use-of-force, thought and intent based on threat level. When I'm pulled over for a traffic stop, and your hand is on your pistol, I'm personally thinking of how to kill you, not what to say next--use of force goes both ways.
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Fri Jul 15, 2016 7:31 am

Mk3 wrote:...When people see you as a lethal enforcer, as nothing but force, they react with self preservation in mind rather than community. If self preservation means killing you (the enforcer) they are very willing to do it, to abate this, you need to build a community. This was in my neighborhood. I am now less likely to call the police, especially if my child is nearby, because I no longer trust their training, and their defaults. Having held lethal authority has made me more wary of it than ever before (I mean, no one should trust me with lives, much less hundreds at a time). When in situations requiring the aforementioned split-second decision making muscle memory is irrefutably key. If the muscle memory (ie training) is to grab a lethal instrument, then use of the lethal instrument will be the default condition, and the killing continues. Now to the race piece.

...

I have taught my son to be respectful toward the police, and be compliant, but to do so in line with what he knows is right. That if he knows he's in the right, don't argue, follow directions, and we'll sort it out later. I had to have this conversation with him after we were on the playground and upon seeing a police car he said to me "dad cops, we need to go" this was two years ago, he was five, and I puked in my mouth. He learned in daycare from his very diverse friend group, all military kids, that it is safer to walk away when you see police then to continue what you are doing, even benign activities. My son taught me about what it means to be a non-white kid in the US, without ever meaning to. [since the dearth of humor in my post is bothering me, though my external reaction was to be calm, internally I was thing "I pay homeowners fees every year for this crap-asstic little park, let that motherfucker get out of his car, I'll ask for his mothrefuckin HOA tag" because after all I'm still a white suburban asshole]...


This. All this, including what I trimmed. Well said, Junior.


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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby jae » Fri Jul 15, 2016 8:06 am

Mk3 wrote:We as humans have a natural disposition to dis-trust people that are different from us. Our culture defines how we establish those differences, but race is fairly typical, as it is visually obvious. THis has developed of millenia, and on the whole kept us well off as a species who identifies other groups and their territories as off limits. This matters when considering that most of the police force is white, and likely being raised in a community where non-white people are "them" a given individual policeman will organically default to mistrust and weariness of them. That much is natural, and to deny it is to instigate further problems because it allows ignorance to the necessity of rigorous training to react non-confrontationally.


Yes. I agree completely, and is why I get so frustrated when people so vehemently deny being racist. We all are. In a lot of cases it's reinforced and strengthened by what we observe and are taught, but I do believe it's instinctively there in all of us. I don't think that naturally there is "good" and "bad", there is "us" and there is "not us" and we are instinctively wary of "not us". I think the current race discussion in this country needs to focus more on acknowledging that we all are biased (whether it's skin tone, culture, religion, lifestyle, etc), and on how to grow past it.
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby jae » Fri Jul 15, 2016 8:09 am

guitargeek wrote:...because there is no God?


Then why are there like 15 Poke-spots or whatever on our church grounds? Obviously there's a God, and he wants us to master all the Pokemon. :P
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Merlyn » Fri Jul 15, 2016 9:04 pm

Someone mentioned earlier that this sort of thing has been going on for decades, the only difference is people have cameras now.

BINGO!

Growing up in rural Texas, I was a short fat white kid with long hair. I use to get pulled over for suspicion of being suspicious about 2-3 times a week, and got my ass kicked several times. Then I had a local kid try to kill me (long story) and reported him to the Hardin county sheriff's office. Unfortunately for me, the guy was a snitch (excuse me, CI) for one of the deputies, and things went downhill fast. I was picked up for "questioning" about whatever case they had open that week, taken to the county jail and beaten half to death several times.

A few years after I escaped Hardin County, Texas, I had the Greg county Sheriff "convince" me to sign a statement that in no way resembled my report with a bar of soap in a sock- after I was arrested for reporting my motorcycle stolen.

To sum up, nothing has changed much. The police are still the enemy if you are poor- or even if you don't look, act and think just like they do.

As I've been saying since the mid '80s:

Cops will do whatever the fuck they want, whenever they want- and all you can do about it is keep your head down, don't draw attention to yourself and be thankful any time it's not YOU laying face down in the ditch, coughing up blood and wishing your mommy was there.

It's a goddam shitty way to have to think, but it's reality. Might as well rail against the Law of Gravitation.

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Thu Jul 21, 2016 12:36 pm

Fucking thugs.

WaPo wrote:Police in South Florida shot an unarmed black caretaker Monday as he tried to help his autistic patient.

Charles Kinsey was trying to retrieve a young autistic man who had wandered away from an assisted living facility and was blocking traffic when Kinsey was shot by a North Miami police officer.


phpBB [media]


LINK

At what point do the PoPo engage in a little self-reflection regarding their itchy trigger fingers?

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Rench » Thu Jul 21, 2016 2:35 pm

At least they didn't send in the droid since the conversation wasn't going well...

Shitty attempt at levity, I know.

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Thu Jul 21, 2016 5:55 pm

Rench wrote:At least they didn't send in the droid since the conversation wasn't going well... Shitty attempt at levity, I know.


Image

Oh, I'm sure I can find some really grim humor in there somewhere, but it's becoming increasingly clear why the Black community can't.

You'd think that cops would be a little more hesitant nowadays to unholster their sidearms. It seems the opposite is true.

Seriously, though, this is fucking absurd. All these episodes simply underscore some fundamental problem in the way the cops are trained and/or socialized.

That needs un-fucked post-haste or things are going to get really ugly.

If I were Black, I'd be thinking about joining the Panthers too.

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Wed Jul 27, 2016 11:46 am

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/pos ... 5d71bb9686

...because hippies taste better when they're cooked medium well. :roll:

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Fri Jul 29, 2016 1:15 pm

Krispy Kreme = Meth.

No, really.

WaPo wrote:It wasn’t the first time someone claimed a Krispy Kreme doughnut was a type of drug. But the joke wasn’t funny for a Florida man who was arrested when an officer mistook doughnut glaze for methamphetamine.

Now Daniel Frederick Rushing is looking to sue the Orlando Police Department, which is also facing heat for its inaccurate roadside drug test.



LINK: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/mor ... ?tid=sm_fb

...'cuz drugs r'bad, mmmmkay?

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby DerGolgo » Fri Jul 29, 2016 2:01 pm

I'm sure someone with an appropriately dirty mind might say
Now, here's a thug who can have me under her jackboot!
Dunno who, but I'm sure they exist.

https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2016 ... thief.html
Image

How this is relevant to this thread?
There's another difference between COPS and the jackbooted thug.
A COP is a COP even when she's not on duty. Even when she's grabbing some rays, just chillin' in her bikini. Then some punk nicks somebodies cellphone. And bikini or no bikini, that punk is GOING DOWN. As we see here.
No body armour, no truncheon, no reinforcements on their way, no nothing.
A cop judges the situation. Can she bring the punk down with what she's got, that is nothing but herself and her cop-training, or can't she?
She can? Punk goes down, end of story.
Jackbooted Thug, meanwhile, if he can even be brought to pay attention to petty theft when he's busy grabbing aforesaid rays. He'll get on he horn and call in the 82nd airborne caricature that police in the US seems to have become in many places, based on media portrayal.
Unless punk is a kid, and no big brother in sight, Jackbooted Thug won't do nuffin till he's get reinforcements. Even if the punk is on his lonesome, and thug could jackboot him to heck.
Yes, bikini cop here appears to have help. Another lady in civvies. And with a hairstyle that lets me suspect she is more likely the owner of the stolen cellphone, rather than an undercover cop. They don't tend to have hairstyles that get in the way easy.
Jackbooted thug, meanwhile, draws his sense of righteousness and justification for his action from his badge. But thugs draw strength from intimidating gear and overwhelming force, from strength in numbers.
COPS, meanwhile, can take responsibility for what they do or don't do. With a herd to back them up - or not.
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Fri Jul 29, 2016 2:08 pm

DerGolgo wrote:I'm sure someone with an appropriately dirty mind might say
Now, here's a thug who can have me under her jackboot!
Dunno who, but I'm sure they exist.


Heh. That gal is ripped too. Dayum.

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:17 pm

OK, boys and girls, let's talk about this:

WaPo wrote:Sessions greenlights police to seize cash, property from people suspected of crimes but not charged

The Justice Department announced a new federal policy Wednesday to help state and local police take cash and property from people suspected of a crime, even without a criminal charge, reversing an Obama administration rule prompted by past abuse by police.

...

Two years ago, then-Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. barred state and local police from using federal law to seize cash and other property without criminal charges or warrants. Since 2008, thousands of police agencies had made more than 55,000 seizures of cash and property worth $3 billion under a Justice Department civil asset forfeiture program, which allowed local and state police to make seizures and then share the proceeds with federal agencies.

A Washington Post investigation in 2014 found that state and local police had seized almost $2.5 billion from motorists and others without search warrants or indictments since the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001. The Post series revealed that police routinely stopped drivers for minor traffic infractions, pressed them to agree to searches without warrants and seized large amounts of cash when there was no evidence of wrongdoing.

Police then spent the proceeds from the seizure with little oversight, according to the Post investigation. In some cases, the police bought luxury cars, high-powered weapons and armored cars. ...



This is so obviously an opening for abuse and corruption on the part of the police that it makes my teeth itch. How anybody can claim it's a good idea with a straight face... I'm tempted to say I can't believe it, but for a fascist fuckwit like Sessions it makes perfect sense.

Wait, wasn't Trump's administration supposed to make the government less invasive?

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby DerGolgo » Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:21 pm

Jaeger wrote:Wait, wasn't Trump's administration supposed to make the government less invasive?

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Well, yeah, they're doing that.
They are making government less invasive into arbitrary police thuggery and abuses of power.
They are creating a "marketplace" solution to civil and individual right, rule of law, and conduct of government officers. If you're a billionaire with a wall of bodyguards around you, and an army of lawyers at your beck and call, the marketplace makes sure you don't have to worry about the cops taking what valuables you have on your person, like a $10,000 watch, a $2,000 tie clip, $3,500 cufflinks, or even the million dollars you have in bank accounts in the US when, as a billionaire in the free marketplace of lawlessness, 99.9% of your wealth is elsewhere and untouchable to begin with and enough for a million people to live off for years.
A poor punk, meanwhile, who's $200 cellphone represents the only item of value they even have on their person, who's $48.20 they have in cash with them is their entire monetary wealth, no bank account or nothing. Such a person can have their life destroyed by everything getting confiscated in the same free marketplace. Since poverty is something someone chooses like a flavor of Ben&Jerrys, as we keep being told, that poor punk has only himself to blame for failing in the marketplace of lawlessness and it's not just the right of the cops to take him out of circulation, but their duty. So that poor punk won't be a drain on society as he's out there, getting not a penny in welfare, assistance or healthcare, yet recklessly walking along public streets. So he can contribute by becoming part fo the glamorous and proud prison labor force.
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Tue Apr 02, 2019 9:24 pm

Fuckin' U.S. Park Rangers. Over a fuckin' handicap parking space.

WaPo wrote:Militants in southern Afghanistan had already salted the earth with bombs when Sgt. Dominic Esquibel led his Marines through Sangin. On his final patrol, the ground ruptured under his feet in an explosion of light and blood.

The blast tore at his right arm and shattered parts of his right leg and foot.

“I thank God it was me,” he told author Bing West from a hospital bed in 2011, “rather than one of my men.”

Doctors were barely able to salvage Esquibel’s foot. He wears an carbon-fiber exoskeleton brace to help him walk and run.

Dominic Esquibel. (Butch Wagner)

And that vulnerable spot is where Esquibel said a U.S. Park Ranger gave swift kicks during an arrest over a parking space for the disabled at Sequoia National Park in 2012, prompting a lawsuit claiming assault and false arrest.

The federal government settled for $250,000 in March to avoid a trial scheduled for last week. A charge of failing to follow a lawful order was dropped in 2014.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/national ... ed-parking

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby DerGolgo » Thu Apr 04, 2019 1:58 pm

What. The. Actual. Fuck.

A veteran, a disabled veteran who gave his body to serve his country. Is kicked to the ground over a fucking parking space he should have been entitled to use in the first place?!

Remind me, when was the last millionaire Wall Street fuck kicked to the ground for cheating on his taxes?!
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby motorpsycho67 » Sun Apr 07, 2019 2:25 am

jae wrote:I get so frustrated when people so vehemently deny being racist. We all are. In a lot of cases it's reinforced and strengthened by what we observe and are taught, but I do believe it's instinctively there in all of us. I don't think that naturally there is "good" and "bad", there is "us" and there is "not us" and we are instinctively wary of "not us".



What a steaming crock of shit.

Everytime someone trots out this line of crap, it's to make them feel better about their own prejudices.

You projectionists need to realize it's a great big world out there and not everyone was raised in the dark.
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby DerGolgo » Sun Apr 07, 2019 6:51 am

motorpsycho67 wrote:
jae wrote:I get so frustrated when people so vehemently deny being racist. We all are. In a lot of cases it's reinforced and strengthened by what we observe and are taught, but I do believe it's instinctively there in all of us. I don't think that naturally there is "good" and "bad", there is "us" and there is "not us" and we are instinctively wary of "not us".



What a steaming crock of shit.

Everytime someone trots out this line of crap, it's to make them feel better about their own prejudices.

You projectionists need to realize it's a great big world out there and not everyone was raised in the dark.


I hadn't seen that earlier, or I don't recall.
I agree with MS67, I must say.
Racism is learned. It my be >instinctual<, it may be that anyone who doesn't pay attention to not developing prejudice falls for the "them and us" dichotomy. Old herd instincts die hard.
But it is still learned. Just like not judging people by some superficial bs must probably be learned.

I had that conversation with someone who studied pedagogics, she gave me the whole lecture on Piaget's balloon experiments. The newborn cannot distinguish skin-color. They will recognize a face, and will react to a smile - even if its drawn on a green balloon.
What matters is what happens during our formative years. Kids try to find belonging, to a social group or whatever. Being part of a group was an evolutionary advantage, and it all developed in a time when a person wouldn't meet more than 150 different people in their entire life. Those instincts aren't well suited to the modern world, modern as of ca. 2,000 or more years ago.
These days?

For many, I guess they notice different emotions when confronted with people of different ethnic background.
Likewise, many will notice different emotions when they meet people who obviously lead different lifestyles. Y'all remember the Grand Poobah's tales of why this place is called what it's called?
Once we are done being socialized, once we are done being formative, it's probably difficult to change that sort of stuff. I don't think it's impossible, just difficult.
What matters is what we do with our prejudices. Whether or not we practice some introspection to recognize them, to rationally evaluate them, and try and control our behavior. What matters is whether we figure we should overcome our prejudices, whether we decide to treat the people against whom we may have an irrational prejudice with decency and equitably.

If anything, someone who has to overcome a prejudice, and makes an effort to do so, deserves far more laurels than someone who never had any such prejudice. The latter person may have a sound outlook on life, solid, how anybody should treat others. But they don't have to make the actual effort. They don't do nothing wrong, but they don't have to make an effort. Those who do make the effort, and take it seriously, don't just play "politically correct" and not even think about it. Those who really try and improve themselves. They deserve the kudos.

We are socialized for the "them and us". Some of us pick up that people of certain ethnic backgrounds aren't to be trusted like those with a certain other background.
Other differences people pick up on, that they should be wary off, are things like sexuality, gender, religion, the list is endless. And yeah, I'm pretty sure all of us have some irrational prejudice or another. What matters is that we don't make excuses. But that we suck it up. That we admit we have a flaw there, and we do something about it.

That, I think, is probably the greatest and most dangerous human failing. The desperate need to be perfect, to not have flaws. Modern culture seems to teach that anything about a person that isn't "right" may be used against them.
While racism, homophobia, or dumping on the poor and uncultured has become socially unacceptable, on paper if not really, modern culture seems to demand that we deny any such flaws in ourselves, or to redefine them as "not flaws". We learn from early on that we must hang our self-validation on whatever ideal of personal perfection we are socialized to aspire to.
But as AA teaches us, the first thing you gotta do to fix a problem is to recognize that you have a problem. I'm sure many people who'd deny insurance coverage to someone of a different skin color, or just seem to keep loosing the paperwork for that gay couple or whatever, all those little things, they tell themselves they aren't racist, nor homophobic.
Because society has deemed such to be unacceptable, and they are just amazing people. So they can't be racist or homophobic, right, or they wouldn't be so amazing, would they. No need to address any problem, because as they have learned from childhood, you just gotta be confident, you just gotta know how amazing you are. They never practice the introspection to see if maybe they have some prejudice, they never do anything to correct it.
Meanwhile, some people just have massive prejudice - they just don't figure it's irrational, or even immoral. Of course she'll deny a marriage license to the gay couple, because god!
Religion's main purpose seems to be, for many, to justify why they don't have to address any flaws they have, or to rationalize why it's fine for them to hang their self-validation on hating others.

Making allowances, not recognizing that having a personal flaw or two doesn't render one just a totally worthless pile of crap, can easily let one rationalize why one doesn't have to address a flaw. And you know what? There are personal flaws that just don't fucking matter, it's fine to have them, and not fix them.
Those flaws that affect how one interacts with and treats other people. Those are the ones it's not okay to just rationalize away, those are the ones one must address. It's not an irreversible sentence of being an asshole, admitting that flaw is not equal to wiping away any self-worth one might have had. But whether or not, and how, one addresses such a flaw. That's the one with bells on.
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:18 am

WaPo wrote:
A Florida cop planted meth on random drivers, police say. One lost custody of his daughter.


...Wester, who was fired last September, was arrested Wednesday and charged with 52 counts of racketeering, false imprisonment, official misconduct, fabricating evidence and possession of controlled substances, among other charges. He’s accused of indiscriminately targeting innocent drivers and hauling them off to jail after planting meth or marijuana in their vehicles while feigning a “search."

“There is no question that Wester’s crimes were deliberate and that his actions put innocent people in jail,” Chris Williams, the Florida Department of Law Enforcement’s assistant special agent in charge, said in a news release.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2 ... s-scandal/

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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Bigshankhank » Thu Jul 11, 2019 11:58 am

Yeah, the Panhandle is merely Southern Alabama, not too surprising.

Sad note along these lines, saw an article from a local news site that one of my nephews was arrested during a failed attempt at a gas station robbery. Was trying to steal Juuls, but ended up being subdued by other patrons. So no only is he a criminal, he's an inept one. Xmas dinner is going to be awkward this year.
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby DerGolgo » Thu Jul 11, 2019 12:18 pm

Jaeger wrote:...scariest shit I've read all week...


Yeah, well. At least that blue wall of silence isn't stepping in this time.
One must wonder, though. Just how outrageous was this fella's "work" getting that the authorities no longer saw him as one of their own? And how many lives has he destroyed when he felt sure in the knowledge, the guys would never doubt or investigate one of their own. And if they did, if some outside forced them to, wouldn't find anything incriminating, just netting him a few weeks of unexpected paid vacay, before returning "as a hero" to the guys.
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby Jaeger » Thu Aug 08, 2019 9:46 am

Bigshankhank wrote:The world is a fucking wreck, but there is still sunshine in some places. Go outside and look for it.


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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby DerGolgo » Thu Aug 08, 2019 11:00 pm

This dirtbag stated that he was blackmailing her. He didn't say "something to the effect". She asked him, using that word, and he said "Yeah".

Never mind him still being on duty.
HOW IS HE STILL A FREE MAN?!?! :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x


Seriously!

:x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x :x
The Rule Of Law isn't a piece of grammar you have to take care to apply when writing an angry letter!

I actually just started writing an angry email to the Monroe County administration. I don't do that sort of thing, but the fact that this pos wasn't in jail, let alone still on duty, just blew a fuse for me.
While typing, I found I should check the date of the article. It's from August 30, 2018.
It appears that, where this man's superiors and the local administration had failed, the fourth estate did it's job by publicizing this failure of the powers that be to apply the law to one of their own and forcing them to do their fucking job. Within a single day!

https://www.newsweek.com/georgia-deputy ... pe-1098523
On August 31, 2018, on Fox5Atlanta.com, the unknown journalist wrote:Deputy fired, arrested following FOX 5 I-Team Investigation

MONROE COUNTY, Ga. - Agents with the Georgia Bureau of Investigation arrested and charged a Monroe County Sheriff’s Deputy Thursday, days after a FOX 5 I-Team investigation revealed a secret recording of him trying to blackmail a suspect into having sex.

Agents charged Deputy Bill Miller with violation of oath of a public officer, which is a felony.

The arrest came after the Sheriff’s Office fired Miller following an internal investigation.


I was surprised that a Fox affiliate would go after anyone in uniform. I first thought "they are tooting their own horn, aren't they, the original piece wasn't theirs, was it..." But the article Bill linked had cited Fox 5, so... hooray for this particular Fox affiliate. Someone in there prefers getting headlines by revealing the criminals that nobody else will reveal to that outraged all cops are heroes MAGA white lives matter and she damn well wanted it puppet theater that the larger Fox News is so famous for.
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Re: JACKBOOTED THUGS

Postby DerGolgo » Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:08 am

Apparently, he went on trial, and has been sentenced.

http://www.fox5atlanta.com/news/i-team/ ... n-sex-case
On August 6, 2019, on Fox5Atlanta.com, Randy Travis wrote:Disgraced former deputy gets probation in sex case

FORSYTH, Ga. - A former Monroe County sheriff's deputy agreed to be banished from the county after admitting he offered to drop someone's charges in exchange for sex.

Agents charged Deputy Bill Miller with violation of oath of a public officer, which is a felony.

The arrest came after the Sheriff’s Office fired Miller following an internal investigation.
...
He was sentenced last week to eight years probation and a $2000 fine, but no prison time. Roberts told us she wasn't happy with that.

But Monroe County District Attorney Jonathan Adams said Miller agreed not to ask for first offender status, a right that would have ultimately allowed the conviction to one day disappear.


Wait, what?
...to be banished from the county...


That's... medieval?

I can see why his victim wouldn't be satisfied with his punishment.
But, if nothing else, he won't get his record cleared after x years. He will carry this shit with him forevermore.
AND he got banished from the fucking county. Never heard nor read of banishment being a current form of punishment in the US.
On the one hand, there's a chance he'd want to fuck of out of there anyways, with the notoriety this episode earned him. On the other hand, sexual offenders are often easily forgiven by the general public, so he might have stuck around. Banishment in this context means what I think it means, doesn't it?
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