Since there's so many breeders around here, food for thought

[mtne]

Article in the Atlantic. Hey Parents Leave Those Kids Alone

I was raised feral for the most part. Didn't have much in the way of over site or rules until 9 or so. There was a lot of bad shit that happened but none of it was really due to a lack of general parental oversight. Even then I regularly wandered Capital hill in Denver on my own (skipped half a year of school and no one noticed.....) or once back in the country rode my bicycle 7 miles to town and back on a two lane highway near daily for either sports practice or work at 14. This was all late 70's early 80's. I get the impression that the kind of shit would get a kid put in the system and the parent arrested these days.

Best example: In Denver at 10 I was allowed to sell flowers on the street corner at night basically alone. Just the van guy coming by to replenish my flower bucket. My mom would be dropped off on her corner and not close at all. I was paid the same as the adults. Learned how to handle cash, deal with strangers in the city, keep inventory count and stay safe around traffic. One valentines day I made $75.......
I can't imagine the shit storm that would get stirred up if anyone tried to let their kid do that these days.

In contrast, ladytiki was delivering neighborhood newsletters a few weeks ago and A was is the stroller. A stranger berated her for leaving the stroller on the sidewalk as she walked up to the houses to put the newsletter on the door. Went so far as to try and involve the police for neglect. She wasn't more than 30' away on flat ground/wheels locked, good sight lines etc.

[Rench]

Haven't read the article yet, but I see where you're coming from.

I truly do believe people should look out for each other more than we do, but its not a particularly fine line between "hey, is this kid being tended to?" and berating a stranger because their tending isn't up to your high standards.

Off to the article now...

-Rench

[Mk3]

Recalling my own shennanigans, my son just got a lot more freedom, and I have a perfect rationale to give it to him with his recent birthday. I already give him the responsibility, time for the good part. Though to be fair I've been trying to get him to do half the shit I did. he won't climb a damn tree or catch a lizard or eat a grasshopper or a worm. Probably unsurprisingly I'm not really "tame" per se, and have done these things to try and get him to take freakin chances. All I've gotten so far was a mouth full of earthworm shit. What I'm getting at is, given the freedom, my spawn acts like a russian in a supermarket. While blighted by the initial shock he buys borscht and walks out never bothering to grasp the full expanse of his opportunities.

So, my query to ponder, how does one remove an individual who is otherwise performing very well in their societal role, without detrimentally diminishing their ability to function in that society? As for my son, I expect that my insistence of him using tools and helping me all the time will make him odd. I'm sure that the fact he has "helped" me solder pipe by holding the blow torch sets him apart from his peers. But if were to cut him loose to the "using a sled to surf snow melt in flooded fields" idiocy adventure that I pursued, would that put him so far apart for his social peers that he couldn't recuperate (other than the fact no other parent would ever let their kid to my house, an idea I'm fond of).

that said, military parents continue to be my favorites in our current culture "Daddy what if someone tries to kill me? Kill em back, and do it faster" direct quote from another parent/preschooler in passing at daycare.

[mtne]

Semi-Relevant thread.

[Metalredneck]

Dad worked oilfield, we baby-sat a 400lb emotional minefield of a mother. Until I got a bike at 13. Gone.

[MATPOC]

few years ago I left the kid sleeping in the car while I was about 6' away talking to a client.
At some point I noticed a woman circling the car, acting all nervous and concerned look on her face,
she starts dialing the cell phone as I step out of the shadow: "Can I help you?"...
She was dialing police because she found an abandoned baby in my car!

[srg]

conversely, such a problem can go the other way, and (older/adult) kids may find that their parents/other family are in the way (often with no option but obedience).

[Bigshankhank]

conversely, such a problem can go the other way, and (older/adult) kids may find that their parents/other family are in the way (often with no option but obedience).

So, helicopter parenting gone too far you're saying? Well documented problem, I had a couple of roommates in college who were victims of this, and it was sad to witness the inevitable crumbling of the facade as in each case it represented a significant loss on the part of the child (dropping out of school in one case, loss of a leg through untreated diabetes for the other).

We gave our children a wide berth, probably too much in the case of our son but water under the bridge at this point. In fact, our eldest daughter has come to us (at 29 years old now) and told us she wished we had taken more responsibility away from her when she was an older teen, as she felt overwhelmed and just need a little more guidance to avoid some mistakes that have plagued her in the years since. Unfortunately I was just entering the family when she was 18 and by that point, I was mostly following her mother's (my wife's) lead on how to be a parent. Nevertheless I do everything I can to be there for her now as an advisor and mentor in every way I can (including restoring a 65 Honda S65 for her 30th birthday). I helped her through her MSF course a few years ago by giving her some additional saddle-time on my old RS100, and more importantly I keep her motivated when she gets shit on at work and needs help navigating the adult business world. It is crazy what passes for a job these days, the millenial generation is really getting a raw deal.


Being a parent never does stop, but it gets to be a hell of a lot more fun the older they get.

[Jaeger]

Being a parent never does stop, but it gets to be a hell of a lot more fun the older they get.

I'm looking forward to that part. Mine are still both toddlers so I'm knee-deep in a hoopla. Still, I'm trying to enjoy this part as best I can. I just know that in about 10 years the problems will get WAAAY more complicated.

Additionally, I'm increasingly convinced that we—the GenXers who graduated HS in the early/mid '90s—are the last ones to get out sane. When I was a kid there were no cellphones, no internet, no pagers... and we as kids could GTFO without mom and dad being totally up our asses all the time. We had freedom. The next generation grew up with the electronic leash.

As far as giving the kids space, I like to think we do OK on that front. My oldest is 4 so they still require quite a bit of supervision, but I'm not afraid of letting them get hurt. I don't want them to get injured, but "hurt" (e.g., falling off the swing at the playground, skinning knee on the street) is part of being a kid. We don't make a big fuss about it. Usually neither to they. I get dirty looks from other parents when minding them at the playground, but that's their problem.

--Jaeger

[Bigshankhank]

Being a parent never does stop, but it gets to be a hell of a lot more fun the older they get.

I'm looking forward to that part. Mine are still both toddlers so I'm knee-deep in a hoopla. Still, I'm trying to enjoy this part as best I can. I just know that in about 10 years the problems will get WAAAY more complicated.

--Jaeger

Funny text of the week came from my 20 year old son, paraphrased it read "Don't buy my girlfriend anything expensive for xmas, I am going to break up with her after the new years." Seriously it gets so much more interesting...

[Mk3]

Being a parent never does stop, but it gets to be a hell of a lot more fun the older they get.

I'm looking forward to that part. Mine are still both toddlers so I'm knee-deep in a hoopla. Still, I'm trying to enjoy this part as best I can. I just know that in about 10 years the problems will get WAAAY more complicated.

--Jaeger

Funny text of the week came from my 20 year old son, paraphrased it read "Don't buy my girlfriend anything expensive for xmas, I am going to break up with her after the new years." Seriously it gets so much more interesting...

Hank, why aren't your scions among the denizens of destruction that are UTMC? The frak man, you've got disMembering to do!

[Bigshankhank]

Hank, why aren't your scions among the denizens of destruction that are UTMC? The frak man, you've got disMembering to do!

For the same reason I don't let them look through my sock drawer.

[MoraleHazard]

I get dirty looks from other parents when minding them at the playground, but that's their problem.

--Jaeger

Hahahah; the mental picture of helicopter moms giving you the death glare and expecting it to mean anything is hilarious.

[Mk3]

Hank, why aren't your scions among the denizens of destruction that are UTMC? The frak man, you've got disMembering to do!

For the same reason I don't let them look through my sock drawer.

I think he just called us a bunch of dildos. Did Hank just call us a bunch of dildos?